Again: Afraid of UNIT LIMIT -> POLL

[edosoft]

Hi there...

I found out I can build up to 88 units(if i didn't miscount...) whereas i am able to build about 120 to 130 structures!

Couldnt you set the unit limit to about 500 or so so it is really enaugh for _everybody_?
Are 64 megabyte of ram not enaugh to store little information of about 500 units per player?
even if you needed 100 bytes of ram for every unit it would take about 50 kb! and this for lets say 3 players and the same number for the structores so you have 300 kilobyte!
Thats not much since the most navigation softwares need 8 megabyte program memory and as it gets free at game exit.

but of couse if its not possible to raise the limit you could perhaps balance it a bit. I mean, who needs 120 power plants?!? If you could set to 50 structures and use the won space for units to have about 150 units would be good for a start.



I have got a "Yakumo delta 300 GPS" (seen here: http://www.yakumo.de/produkte/index.php?pid=1&ag=PDAs&lang=2#1033999)
With 64 mb ram and 32 mb rom and a 64 mb storage card where the game is installed on.
Do I have any chances of increasing the limit perhaps if i delete files or buy a bigger storage card?
(Or by manipulating game executable or a map?)



And plase, spiffcode, release version 1.3 with this unit limit fix and with the minimap fix i specified here:
http://www.handmark.com/warfare/forum/viewtopic.php?p=7247#7247

Thanks in advance!

-Dominik Weber

[A Shadow]

500 units per player!? If you are playing a 4-way multiplayer map, that is 2,000 units!!! Even the largest maps would barely be able to hold that many units. In addition, they wouldn't fit in your base- they would be pouring out of it! This is a game of strategy and putting a limit on the number of units is important. Plus, unless you are losing terribly, you shouldn't need to build that many units, and if you are losing so badly you need 500 units, chances are you won't have the time or money to make that many at once.

Putting all of this aside, I found this in the Mission Editor's help file. It was titled "Limits" and explains how the unit and structure limits work:

Computer Structure Limit : 52
Computer Mobile Unit Limit : 80
Human Structure Limit : 39 + unused Computer amount - 5
Human Mobile Unit Limit : 60

Example : If the computer only has 36 structures (buildings, towers, etc), then the human player can have 39 + (52 - 36) - 5 = 50.


I recommend, not to build up huge armies to destroy the enemy, but to make groups to attack the enemy in waves, sort of. I'm sure your intentions were good, but I think that the unit limit is about good where it is.

As for the minimap, I along with many others agree that it can be annoying at times, and their should be an option to hide it, or something like that.

[PhillipEarl]

This has been brought up before. Basically, Spiffcode set the limits where they are because they were the maximum that could be fit into a given level without causing a major slowdown on some of the older devices.

[edosoft]

Yes, but if you had an option in the map editor to set up unit limits the people with older devices could play smaller maps to avoid a slowdown.

Then of couse you should also be able to build larger maps where you can biuld real strategical bases and use this higher number of units wisely.

And because of to less galaxite in those big wars there should be an object in the editor which works like a pump to bring galaxite to the top of the ground, like it is in "Command & Conquer: Tiberan Sun".
You can place this pump in big fields of galaxite and it slowly "refreshes" the galaxite field, that means of you collected all the gallaxite it builds new galaxite around it. You should be able to set up multiple of those pumps in the editor, but you shouldnt build them in the game.

[PhillipEarl]

What to do then, with multiplayer maps? It wouldn't be fair to design a huge multiplayer maps that would freeze up older devices or lo res devices (like the Treo 600). The current setting makes the game much more stable and much less tech-specific from the mapmaker's standpoint.

Ask me, it's up to the map makers to create missions that are entertaining/rivetting without throwing huge, spawned unit groups at the player incessantly. The challenge of every good map maker is not just to create a level that defeats a player several times before the player finally learns its secret - the real challenge is to create a level that challenges the player as much with finesse as it does with brute force.

I guess my point is that the best levels (Replicator Hazard, Rescue, Cyanide Campaign, Calderas Gold, Chiron's HQ to name a few) don't require players to race to mine extrordinary amounts of galaxite and build massive armies to win the game. Any fool can win through superior numbers. A good level makes a player think, and therefore changes to the unit limits ought to be unnecessary.

[guitarist809]

I wish that there were more units available. That would be really awsome! When im building missions, I always have way too many dudes and have to remove many of them unfortunatly. O well, maby in V1.3 of Warfare there will many more guies for the limit thing.

[altema]

Even though I hit the limit frequently, I like it where it is, as it keeps me from getting carried away. The only exception where I wish it was higher, is when I play multiplayer against two or three opponents, and they decide to team up against me. Last night for example, I was playing "The Forest" against two others, and they both decided to hit me. The only thing that saved me was scouting out an un-used corner early in the game and building a second base. This allowed me to have 4 VTS's and 2 HRC's, so I could build fast enough to keep ahead. Of course, having 3 Galaxite Processors helped... when everyone was out of credits, I just mopped up the opponents.

[hudra]

I used 1000 limit but i lost it and i needed cuz in mp i had 100 units defending my bace and 800 attacking bace 100 scouting and nothing can stop me!!!!! I feel like Adof Hitler in the game. And 500 is defenetly not alot to me. I realy want a 1000 unit patch relesed. And i edited the map size to 200 times bigger but once again i lost the code dfue to hard reset.

[guitarist809]

That would rule if I Could have like 999999 units. They would fill up the map and wipe out any force around it

[guitarist809]

Did you really have that many units, hudra?

[!HUDRA!]

Yep I wana hack the game so it wont have an limit

[guitarist809]

sucks that you deleted the thing. Do you remember what you did?

[!HUDRA!]

Yes it was confusing, my father helped me with C++, Ok Its in some sort of file translated from palm os to C++ I used the palm os emulator to do that. The file name is called "Units_prefs" or somthing like that. And it was called MAX_GAME_UNITS or somthing like that. Dont belive me? check this file out from freelancer it was writen in C++


[Constants]
COLLISION_DAMAGE_FACTOR = 0.500000
MUSIC_CROSS_FADE_DELAY = 10.000000
MUZZLE_CONE_ANGLE = 40
PLAYER_COLLISION_GROUP_HIT_PTS_SCALE = 3
PLAYER_ATTACHED_EQUIP_HIT_PTS_SCALE = 5

[EngineEquipConsts]
CRUISE_DISRUPT_TIME = 5
MAX_DELTA_FX_THROTTLE = 0.250000
THROTTLE_STEADY_TIME = 0.500000
THROTTLE_ATTEN_MOD_RANGE = 8.000000
DELTA_THROTTLE_ATTEN_MOD_CHANGING = 8.000000
DELTA_THROTTLE_ATTEN_MOD_STEADY = -1.000000
CRUISE_STEADY_TIME = 2.000000
DELTA_CRUISE_ATTEN_MOD_STEADY = -1.000000
CRUISE_ATTEN_MOD_RANGE = 8.000000
CRUISING_SPEED = 600

[ShieldEquipConsts]
HULL_DAMAGE_FACTOR = 0.500000

[PhySysConsts]
MATERIAL_FRICTION = 0.100000
MATERIAL_ELASTICITY = 0.900000
DEFAULT_LINEAR_DAMPING = 0.500000
DEFAULT_ANGULAR_DAMPING = 0.200000, 0.200000, 0.200000
ANOM_LIMITS_MAX_VELOCITY = 600

[CommConsts]
COMM_PLAYER_FAR_DIST = 6000.000000
COMM_PLAYER_FAR_DIST_ATTEN = 0.000000
CHATTER_MAX_DIST = 3500.000000
CHATTER_MAX_DIST_ATTEN = -16.000000
CHATTER_START_ATTEN = -2.000000
COMM_CONFLICT_PRIORITY_CUTOFF = -3
WALLA_MAX_DIST = 3500.000000
WALLA_MAX_DIST_ATTEN = -24.000000
WALLA_START_ATTEN = -8.000000
WALLA_PRIORITY_CUTOFF = -3

[AsteroidConsts]
MAX_ASTEROID_LOOT_DAMAGE = 20000.000000
MAX_LOOT_PER_ASTEROID = 3

[guitarist809]

That looks like the coding for SAMBA

[shareserver]
guest ok = yes
path = /var/www/html/


..you get the point...

[dancer402]

If they had too many units, it could be a masacre and there would be huge bloody battles and you would need enough galaxite so it would REALLY eat up your palms RAM and the older palms wouldn't get to play at all.

[Verdagon]

Galaxite... galaxite should grow back. Or maybe have another unit, a really expensive one, which digs it up out of the ground (ground has unlimited in it) except its really slow, and it can't mine it itself (A bullpup needs to mine it after it digs it up or something) but I'm rambling...

[Verdagon]

Oh, right. I remember what I was gonna say...

I don't care about the older PDAs, I mean, if they really wanted to use games on them they'd get a better one. Who plays games on a Palm Vx anymore? And theres no devices that have bluetooth or wifi that have less than 16 mb space. Maybe there could be a higher limit for multiplayer.

Another idea is that in multiplayer, warfare will analyze all the players' available space and make the maximum units according to the maximum space on the least-spacious device. That would be both fair, and good for games between two high-memory devices.